5007 replies to this topic

[Spaloo]

You know what I don't understand, why you are so bitter? You bang the "realism" drum all the time, but when someone makes a suggestion based on the fact of realism, (not just my recent staffing suggestion), you act like a 5 year old and stomp your feet.

Is the mod supposed to be real or easy, tell me that - then I'll know what suggestions to make or not.

So that part of the game isn't going to change. While I agree the timing could be more realistic, the game clock is much faster than real time. So the time it takes for the FF to reach their vehicle is the equivalent of a minute. As far as the initial staffing, I usually take the chief out and move him to his designated "dispatch" spot, his the alarm again to get another chief, then empty all the rigs in the station and send them back into the station.

I do have to agree, hoppah did come off a bit rude on that one. I'll chalk it up to a subtle language difference. Either way, nothing we can do about it. It's his mod after all.

Hoppah, I do have a question for you. Are at least some of our suggestions at all helpful? Have you incorporated any of them, or are we being a nuisance to you and the other moderators? If it's a bother, I for one will stop suggesting things and happily, patiently wait for the new release. I like to think that my occasional suggestion does help since I used to work EMS in LA County and the SoCal region, I've been a paramedic for a while now, and I could give you some information that would add to the realism. Who knows, maybe I'm just a pain in the ass. I hope I'm not coming off as ungrateful, I just want to honestly know if we're a help at all.

[Mrtucker555]

You know what I don't understand, why you are so bitter? You bang the "realism" drum all the time, but when someone makes a suggestion based on the fact of realism, (not just my recent staffing suggestion), you act like a 5 year old and stomp your feet.

Is the mod supposed to be real or easy, tell me that - then I'll know what suggestions to make or not.

yea that is alittle uncalled for look at how much hoppah has done so if you dont like somthing thats in the mod dont take it out on hoppah like that you find out how to change it and do it yourself

[Hoppah]

There are too many suggestions and people don't read the first post (in the suggestions thread). How many times do we have a tiller truck suggested now? 20 to 30 times?
What about the 'Add this, this and this vehicle please' suggestions?
90% of the suggestion have ONLY to do with a cool appearance, like the huge mobile hospital, the LAFD Hummer or another Dodge Charger.
The first post clearly states that people have to try to add a motiviation to their suggestions. The LAFD Hummer is not being used anymore, the mod already has two Dodge Chargers, the mobile hospital is too big to manouvre through a map in this game. There is even a limit on the maximum number of transports a vehicle can have.

The best suggestion was one from Mikesphotos and that was the new EMS system. I got all the details, pictures and info (including a big excel sheet) I needed and I made it.
He is is someone who knows where he talks about. People suggesting I should add a fire engine from England (yes there was one) don't.

[MikesPhotos]

Are you going to staff the vehicles upon an alarm in a light force/task force configuration?

This has not been decided fully yet, but here is a question to you and everyone, just for my own personal knowledge...
Since there really are no truck ops, would it be annoying to the majority of you to have to disembark the truck, run to the engine, grab the hose and connect to it each fire

or

would you rather just have 2 on the truck and 4 one the engine since you're going to use those 4 on the engine anyways for 99% of all of the calls, and the 2 on the truck can be used for extrication, master stream, and the few truckie duties that are in game. 2 is just the right amount for the things the truck does, and 4 on the 2-car means less hassle because of the quick deploy.

The whole point of the game is understanding that realism has its place, but it is a very delicate balance between real and game. For absolute realism we'd have the game clock be 1 second = 1 second and you'd only get maybe 3 to 10 fire/ems calls after playing it for 24hrs, and maybe 20 police calls.

And speaking of the game clock..........

Well, what he was saying is that the firefighters doesn't come out of the station 1 second after the bell rings, it takes... 20 to 25 seconds, minimum..

One thing I think many of you fail to realize is that there is a thing called a game clock. 1 second does not equal 1 second. The alarm at FS1 sounds for 15 seconds in real time. 15 seconds equals 5 MINUTES in game time. Here are the run stats for the Los Angeles City Fire Dept from Jan to March 2008

What exactly is 'response' time?

Response times are properly calculated using all three of these:

* Dispatch time -- time spent by the call-taker and dispatchers to initiate the dispatch.
* Turnout time -- from dispatch until units are enroute.
* Driving time -- from enroute until units are at the scene.


During January, February and March 2008, the LAFD response times were:

* First resource on scene at Structure Fire incidents – 95% within 5 minutes.
* First resource on scene at life-threatening medical incidents – 87% within 5 minutes.
* First paramedic on scene at life-threatening medical incidents – 86% within 8 minutes.

For those who might find this quote confusing, that means that from the time the citizen dialed 911 and the phone was answered, firefighters were on scene within 5 minutes almost every time. That includes driving time, turnout time, and call time.

Going by those stats, for 100% of the calls where you are hitting the alarm button, you're late to the call! You want realism, then we should speed up the time it takes to get on the rig, not slow it down.

Hoppah, I do have a question for you. Are at least some of our suggestions at all helpful?

I'm not Hoppah, but I will field this one as well. I've spent the last 4 days going through the 60+ pages in the suggestion thread to cull it, make a list, and see what the future of that thread will be. Honestly, it's a lot like panning for gold. There are some really good ideas, some that will be implemented at some point, maybe not this time, but at some point, but the majority, and it's an overwhelming majority are just thoughtless and without merit. Many of the posts in that thread are made by those who feel a need to comment on every post in every thread possible. I don't know if they are trying to boost their post count, or they just like being very very social. On the flip side, there are some great nuggets and some good conversation that added to the thread. It's really like panning for gold.

Mike

[Zallomallo]

Very true.

[dcast55]

I, like some people, like sounding the alarm at the Fire Station myself, but like Mikesphotos said if you want realism you are responding late to the call everytime you go to hit the alarm. The problem is fixing the time it takes the units to exit the building and get into the vehicles. And for all those demanding people, and everyone getting on Hoppah's case, give em a break. It takes so much work to do these things, and I for one am happy with whatever comes out in these mods, and if I don't like something, I will find a way to fix it myself, and not come here and complain all over the forums.

[FD81]

The map is better now,Now there is 2 Fire stations.Just like the real citys have.

[Madman]

So that part of the game isn't going to change. While I agree the timing could be more realistic, the game clock is much faster than real time. So the time it takes for the FF to reach their vehicle is the equivalent of a minute. As far as the initial staffing, I usually take the chief out and move him to his designated "dispatch" spot, his the alarm again to get another chief, then empty all the rigs in the station and send them back into the station.

I do have to agree, hoppah did come off a bit rude on that one. I'll chalk it up to a subtle language difference. Either way, nothing we can do about it. It's his mod after all.

Hoppah, I do have a question for you. Are at least some of our suggestions at all helpful? Have you incorporated any of them, or are we being a nuisance to you and the other moderators? If it's a bother, I for one will stop suggesting things and happily, patiently wait for the new release. I like to think that my occasional suggestion does help since I used to work EMS in LA County and the SoCal region, I've been a paramedic for a while now, and I could give you some information that would add to the realism. Who knows, maybe I'm just a pain in the ass. I hope I'm not coming off as ungrateful, I just want to honestly know if we're a help at all.

It's not the fact that he doesn't want to do it - like Spaloo said above, he came off rude - and this isn't the first time. I realize that there are a million suggestions and most of them are pure nonsense, so that does have to wear thin on someone's patience. I could see his reaction if I asked for a tiller truck for sure, but I think my suggestion was a reasonably valid one and did not warrant the response I got.

I am well aware of the game clock, but in my opinion the game clock is completely unrealistic and has no bearing on the game itself. The game clock is not relative to the size of the map, the cars, the buildings, the people....etc etc. Just because the ridiculously fast game clock says the current response time is close to correct, doesn't mean it is. I guess the BC takes 5+ "real game minutes" to make a radio call, and people walking an in-game block take an hour or moe - the examples could go on and on. Take the response time of trucks off screen. The current mod behaviour is for the trucks to instantly appear on screen, but according to the magical game clock, the response is accurate. But when the BC calls a truck or ambulance from the station, it takes so long there is no way it is correct in relation to the off screen vehicles. All I ask is that ther isn't so much emphasis placed on the game clock and more emphasis placed on how the game truly "feels".

Spaloo also plays the game similar to how I do, so I guess he understands how the timing could be tweaked to have the game play more in ratio to how everything else occurs in the game.

Spaloo truly does get it. If you want us to stop suggesting, that's totally fine. I will patiently wait for your next release and know that what will follow will be great and I will enjoy your efforts. You've done great work with your mod, (I've played it since the beginning in EM3 and have played the entire EM series since the beginning), and nothing I have said suggests the opposite. Your mod is the only reason I play this game and will continue to play in the future.

Regards,
Madman

[MikesPhotos]

I am well aware of the game clock, but in my opinion the game clock is completely unrealistic and has no bearing on the game itself. All I ask is that ther isn't so much emphasis placed on the game clock and more emphasis placed on how the game truly "feels".


Regards,
Madman

The game clock plays a major part of the freeplay code from scripts to health/life, to the events themselves. Some things are tweaked for play-ability, others are for realism. You've made your suggestion, its been answered.

[helljumper51]

here is a question. i noticed in game for la mod there are 4 or 5 ambulances. why do we need that many? i know that i only use one, but why 5?


also, is the light equipment truck going to be carrying the emts? i know in the 70's, a vehicle like that called teh rescue squad carried paramedics and they also functioned as firefighters. Is that how it is now in la? Cuz i was thinking that make the light equipment vehicle carry all those tools plus the medic bag, and then the paramedics or whichever one heals people, ride in that squad. it would be interesting to see one station to house that squad so that it can get on scene faster before the ambulance.

i might be completely wrong because i don't know much about recent la fire departments. mike, any suggestions?


-Eric

[Madman]

You've made your suggestion, its been answered.

Haha, nice attitude Mike...it's good to see your new internet fame hasn't gone to your head. Just because I've made my suggestion and "it's been answered" doesn't mean I cannot discuss the speed of the freeplay clock - I honestly don't get you guys and your elitist attitudes. People make suggestions in hopes of making the mod the best it can be, whether those suggestions are 100% accurate or not is irrelevant, they are valid in their mind so they make them with the best of intentions. Or are only gratuitous complimentary posts allowed?

I'll refrain from posting anymore in this thread in respect to the Hoppah and Stan.

[Mrtucker555]

here is a question. i noticed in game for la mod there are 4 or 5 ambulances. why do we need that many? i know that i only use one, but why 5?


also, is the light equipment truck going to be carrying the emts? i know in the 70's, a vehicle like that called teh rescue squad carried paramedics and they also functioned as firefighters. Is that how it is now in la? Cuz i was thinking that make the light equipment vehicle carry all those tools plus the medic bag, and then the paramedics or whichever one heals people, ride in that squad. it would be interesting to see one station to house that squad so that it can get on scene faster before the ambulance.

i might be completely wrong because i don't know much about recent la fire departments. mike, any suggestions?


-Eric

the squads i think still do have paramedics atleast thats why im putting the FF/PMs in mine

[MikesPhotos]

here is a question. i noticed in game for la mod there are 4 or 5 ambulances. why do we need that many? i know that i only use one, but why 5?


also, is the light equipment truck going to be carrying the emts? i know in the 70's, a vehicle like that called teh rescue squad carried paramedics and they also functioned as firefighters. Is that how it is now in la? Cuz i was thinking that make the light equipment vehicle carry all those tools plus the medic bag, and then the paramedics or whichever one heals people, ride in that squad. it would be interesting to see one station to house that squad so that it can get on scene faster before the ambulance.

i might be completely wrong because i don't know much about recent la fire departments. mike, any suggestions?


-Eric

the squads i think still do have paramedics atleast thats why im putting the FF/PMs in mine

The light equipment truck (fictional name from earlier versions of the mod) / Heavy squad is a paramedic resource from the Los Angeles County Fire Department. Because of how spread out Truck co's and Light Forces are in LA County, some areas also include a Heavy Squad which is staffed by 2 Firefighter paramedics as well as necessary tools for extrication and forcible entry. Think of it like a small USAR truck staffed by 2 paramedics. It's primary role in real life is as the LACoFD's primary ALS resource since we contract with 5 different ambulance companies for BLS transport instead of having our own ambulances. You'll find it is a great way to get Medics on scene quickly to areas of the map where there are no stations due to its entry point on the map effectively sticking a 3rd station there.

With the addition of the 2nd station, entry points which were introduced in 1.6 will be changed to better spread out resources throughout both maps with ALS resources being the primary factor and extrication duties being secondary.

I'll refrain from posting anymore in this thread in respect to the Hoppah and Stan.

That's nice.

[theparanoid]

This has not been decided fully yet, but here is a question to you and everyone, just for my own personal knowledge...
Since there really are no truck ops, would it be annoying to the majority of you to have to disembark the truck, run to the engine, grab the hose and connect to it each fire

or

would you rather just have 2 on the truck and 4 one the engine since you're going to use those 4 on the engine anyways for 99% of all of the calls, and the 2 on the truck can be used for extrication, master stream, and the few truckie duties that are in game. 2 is just the right amount for the things the truck does, and 4 on the 2-car means less hassle because of the quick deploy.

The whole point of the game is understanding that realism has its place, but it is a very delicate balance between real and game. For absolute realism we'd have the game clock be 1 second = 1 second and you'd only get maybe 3 to 10 fire/ems calls after playing it for 24hrs, and maybe 20 police calls.

...

Personal I rather have 2 on the truck and 4 on the engine. In fact all your reason are valid.

Your right about the realism. I would like the mod as close to real as possible. But it game. It suppose to be fun to play.

Hoppah, keep up the good work.

Mike, Thanks for information you given, both to hoppah and the rest of us.


::climbs onto his soap box::
As for Hoppah "supossed" rude comment. I read the post several times. I seen nothing rude it in at all. But something to keep in mind. English is not Hoppah native language. It not easy witting in language that not your native tongue.

My take on post was Hoppah respond to a suggestion. Say he would not implement it and why. That means he took time out of his schedule to answer it. He did not agree with you. That is his choice. Getting mad because he did not agree is rude.

Some things to remember Hoppah takes his personal time to create a mod that we all free to enjoy. He those not get paid to work on the mod. He has create a thread for suggestions. Something every one has to remember is Hoppah is not require to work on his mod. If he decide to quit. That it. No more changes no more improvements. He can even decide to pull his mod off the web and only give it to people he wants to.

So some say Hoppah is an elitist. Well let look at that. How many of you have create a mod for Emergency that even close to LA Mod?

I can only think of one mod that close and that mod has a team of people working on it.

I disagree that Hoppah is acting like and elitist. But regardless. If he was so what. Look at what he created? and remember this is Emergency forum for mod for emergency. He deserves to act like an elitist for what he created!!!

::gets of soap box::

[Col. Ghost]

great work Hoppah!

as far as I know they call them in the USA:

EMT-B for basic
EMT-I for intermediate
EMT-P for the Paramedic

never heard of the PM so far.
may be just a little add.

[Mrtucker555]

pm means paramedic its the EMT-I i think

[MikesPhotos]

great work Hoppah!

as far as I know they call them in the USA:

EMT-B for basic
EMT-I for intermediate
EMT-P for the Paramedic

never heard of the PM so far.
may be just a little add.

You are correct in that EMT-P stands for Emergency Medical Technician - Paramedic Level, but FF/PM is a very common abbreviation all over the US for Firefighter/Paramedic. Just google "FF/PM paramedic" and you'll see results on the first page from Virginia, Florida, Alaska, Missouri, LAFD's Battalion 14 blog, Chicago, San Francisco, and more.

pm means paramedic its the EMT-I i think

Actually it'd be the EMT-P